A Message to the BBC on Behalf of True Dog Lovers (Pedigree Dogs Exposed)
You are considering the future with regards to continuing to broadcast Crufts dog show in the wake of the explosive content of the documentary Pedigree Dogs Exposed.
You have stated that you have a two year agreement to continue to show Crufts.
You have seen the content of Pedigree Dogs Exposed. You, like us, MUST have felt the lump in your throat sitting through the extremely harrowing footage of dogs in agonising pain as a result of horrendous breeding practices.
You can not wait two years to make the RIGHT decision. Without reform of the Kennel Club, genuine, far reaching reform NOW, you can not, with any clear conscience continue to endorse the horrors as highlighted by this program.
Please, please do the right thing.
Because judging by the overly defensive position of the Kennel Club who don’t seem to be able to agree even between themselves on what they can and can’t do (Ronnie Irving chair of the KC stated on Pedigree Dogs Exposed that the KC could rule out father to daughter and brother to sister matings – whereas Caroline Kisco on News 24 today insisted that the KC could NOT outlaw this practice), you need to make the right move.
Dogs will thank you for it in the long run.
Highly Recommended: What dog owner wouldn’t want a piece of THIS action? – Get FREE dog food!
Related posts:
- SSPCA Demand BBC Give Crufts the Axe after Pedigree Dogs Exposed
- Pedigree Dogs Exposed: What is the BBC Hiding?
- BBC Issues Crufts TV Coverage Position re Pedigree Dogs Exposed
- BBC’s Continued Coverage of Crufts In Doubt in Wake of Pedigree Dogs Exposed Program
- Pedigree Dogs Exposed Filmmaker Takes Top Award
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Rachel says:
“It’s such a shame YET AGAIN the public bought into this ridiculous and sensationlist story.”
If it wasn’t so serious I would laugh. Ridiculous? Sensationalist? Oh please! I now work in Animal Control and Welfare, not the RSPCA, but for the last 35 years I have trained and handled dogs professionally in life threatening situations. I have watched the German Shepherd and the Labrador in the UK become less and less able to perform meaningful work.
In my full time work I see dogs weekly who need veterinary intervention for hereditory conditions.
I am not anti breeders or dog shows, friends of mine do both, but I would do want to see the KC grasp the nettle and clamp down on exaggerated points in breed standards and allow less litters per bitch.
I won’t bore anyone with the heartache I am going through with my present GSD but the problem is hereditory and fatal. Like all my dogs he is from kemnnels where he was handed in as unwanted at under 6 months old.
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Apologies for the typo’s. I got a little bit upset and angry.
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Dave the Dog
Nice post, know what you mean about the KC needing to take a firm leadership role here.
If they will not, what is the point of them, are they then just another London club for breed judges to come and sit in their luxury premises when they are up in London?
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Im afraid it is ridiculous and sensationalist Dave. I am a very successful breeder and championship show judge. If a dog cannot walk in a straight line or it is slightly lame i will not give it a placing at all. To suggest we let blatently ill dogs win is just completely untrue. Yes that cavalier won BOB but that was an unnoticeable illness it had which she failed to tell people about. Shame on her!
You cannot compare where you got your GSD from. It was handed into a shelter. Do you have its pedigree history? do you know what hereditary diseases run in its family? This does not sound like a dog bred by a KC registered breeder, more like a puppy farmer. Perhaps you should use this anger of yours to attack these people that are actually causing the problems not us innocent breeders!
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Chris Hyde wrote: – “To suggest we let blatently ill dogs win is just completely untrue.”
How do you explain Danny, the dog who took Best in Show in 2003? The very, very top prize in your profession.
How do you explain the German Shepherds who are winning regularly who have a very clear and pronounced roach back?
Find me any KC reg’d pedigree Bulldog in show competition and I’ll show you a blatantly ill dog. I could go on. I just don’t think you’re seeing what everyone else is seeing.
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I’m continually hearing the argument that there are good breeders out there and the program only highlighted the bad breeders. Have these people failed to note the problem highlight by scientific research shows inbreeding is the cause of high incidence of hereditary disease. This means all breeders who breed pedigree dogs under the Kennel Club rules are to blame. Would it be so awful to occasionally outcross to another breed instead of shamefully trying to divert the blame onto the back yard breeders and puppy farmers, which results in no improvement. Under the current standards if you’re a pedigree breeder following the Kennel Club rules you are the problem.
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Lisa im afraid you could not be more wrong. Doing that would cause chaos. I eye test, hip and elbow score all my dogs. I also only breed them to dogs that have had the same health checks. Health testing is incouraged by the KC. I have never had an ill dog in all my years breeding. If we were to outcross all the time like you are saying we are not only crossing two completely different bloodlines but we are producing dogs with possibly more health problems that we may not have come accross before. IT IS SCIENTIFICALLY PROVEN. If we were to do that lisa that would spell doom for our beloved pedigree pets and the images you saw on the programme would become more common.
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Sorry Sazza but you are not correct. Not even close.
Would you mind linking to this ’scientific evidence’ you mention?
All pedigrees are born as a result of crossing then line breeding. Then as you reduce the gene pool (as has to happen with a closed registry such as the one the KC deploy) then you are GUARANTEED to increase and enhance genetic faults. Outcrossing is the ONLY thing you can do to breed out a fault. THAT is science.
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I beg to differ. When I have the time and am not on my work break I will give you the scientific evidence as i have studied genetics as part of my biochemistry degree. The thing is Ryan nothing will change. There are bigger things in the world to worry about. I would rather solve world hunger before I try and improve dog breeding when its already at such a high standard. Get your priorities right and stop whining about such a non-existant problem.
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And there we have it!
“non existent problem” ?
Really?
And if you’re not worried, why are you wasting time with me? You could be doing something to aid world hunger.
I’m afraid attitudes like yours are what’s responsible for the mess that dogs are in.
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Chris
Ryan beat me to it. If you are a good breeder who does not breed dogs with hidden hereditary conditions, great.
I don’t have a problem with you unless you are breeding one the the breeds with ridiculously exagerated features perpetuated by the KC and breed standards.
My Shepherd is just one example, My previous dog was a Black Lab, same background, Hip displacia and OCD.
I agree that the breed lines of both dogs are unknown, the point is that the conditions both dogs suffer from are hereditory. My GSD also has Hip displacia, that will never cause him a major problem, he will not live to see the end of 2009. My second point is that these dogs were both handed in at under 6 months old. Over the years we have had many young dogs that owners have handed in due to hereditory conditions. When we have contacted the known breeder they have refused to take the dog back, yes they were KC registered.
“If a dog cannot walk in a straight line or it is slightly lame I will not give it a placing at all.” I should hope not Chris, but it does happen. However worse than that happens and is accepted because the problems are part of the breed standard.
It says a lot that UK Police Forces and Armed Services are increasingly giving up trying to find suitable dogs in the UK and are sourcing their dogs abroad.
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Sazza, I too would interested in seeing this research, and the date it was published? Breeding best to best was once thought to be the way to produce a healthier dog, this has been proved time and time again to be a flawed concept, inbreeding in this way only achieves to bring more and more hereditary diseases to the surface.
Please tell me your thoughts on the research on the links below. Are the scientists wrong and you’re right? Next you’ll be telling me homozygous is healthy and heterozygous is unhealthy
http://www1.imperial.ac.uk/medicine/news/inbreedingdogs/
http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/articlerender.fcgi?tool=pubmed&pubmedid=17966340
http://www.cawc.org.uk/sites/default/files/CAWCModifications.pdf
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Quote Chris Hyde “Yes that cavalier won BOB but that was an unnoticeable illness it had which she failed to tell people about. Shame on her!”
Why then did the breed club close ranks around her and come to her defence? Instead of shunning the breeder Beverley Costello, they shun the likes of Carol Fowler and Margaret Carter instead. To me that says A LOT
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I am very dissappointed in this site. All you do is attack innocent people.I thought as one of the editors Ryan that you would be more open minded to other peoples’ opinions. Instead I find you quite bullish. I am an owner of two Field spaniels and have nothing to do with breeding or showing dogs. Even I could see how silly this programme was.
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Ryan
“How do you explain Danny, the dog who took Best in Show in 2003? The very, very top prize in your profession.”
Like i said if there is a latent underlying illness in a dog like Danny or the BOB cavalier how are we supposed to know. I did not say all breeders are resposible but the overwhelming majority are. Am i supposed to be a mind reader and know if a dog has a hidden illness? It is impossible to know.
As for the GSP’S!!! If you have ever been to a dog show you will know that all dogs are placed in a standing position by their owners so it is ALSO IMPOSSIBLE to know whether they have bad feet, pasterns etc as they are all placed neatly to give the dog a clean outline. It is up to the exhibitors to be responsible and not enter dogs and then hide their faults. Also when they are on the move their hair (depending on its length) and fast pace disguise any obvious problems. So until you are a judge you will realise how difficult it is to spot these problems when you only have 2 minutes to judge a dog.
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my name is peter gunn my daughter lucy aquired a pug(bitch)lola in feb 2007up to this present date lola has had 4 ops due to a condition know as laryngeal collapse,the latter op requiring a permanent tracheostamy,the dog was purchased for £1200,at present we are currently seeking compensation and becoming a messy affair,is their anybody who has had similar problem and how did you deal with it,and is their anybody who could give us advice on this matter.
thanking you mr p j gunn
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>Posted by Claire Petrie 20th August, 2008 at 1:00 am
I am shocked and appalled ( as I am sure that you are too ) at the conditions of the dogs of this programme last night. ……………. the GSDs who would never (IMO) be able to work. <
Hm interesting as both the GSDs show have working qualifications & were fully health tested & were from Germany(the BOB is resident in Germany)
All my dogs are fully health tested(& I’m a ABS breeder)tomorrow I will be investing another £200 in health screening on a bitch I might never breed from.
How many mongrels are health screeed ? & please don’t roll out that they don’t have health problems because they have exactly the same basic genetic make up asa pedigree dog
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quote>Posted by Dave the Dog 23rd September, 2008 at 5:05 am
Chris
……………………..
My Shepherd is just one example, My previous dog was a Black Lab, same background, Hip displacia and OCD.
I agree that the breed lines of both dogs are unknown, the point is that the conditions both dogs suffer from are hereditory. My GSD also has Hip displacia, that will never cause him a major problem, he will not live to see the end of 2009. My second point is that these dogs were both handed in at under 6 months old. Over the years we have had many young dogs that owners have handed in due to hereditory conditions. When we have contacted the known breeder they have refused to take the dog back, yes they were KC registered.
…………………
It says a lot that UK Police Forces and Armed Services are increasingly giving up trying to find suitable dogs in the UK and are sourcing their dogs abroad.<
The Police are importing adult fully trained & health tested GSDs from Germany, Belgium etc from the same/similar/related to the dogs that were shown @ Crufts. They are finding that the donated dogs(usually bred from un KC reg parents are not suitable & most forces will not buy in puppies.
The forces that breed their own dogs are turning to imported stud dogs(from Germany etc)simlar(& in some cases the dogs being shown here in the UK)from the SV(Germany GSD registry)stock.
The Police do not want the old fashioned Alsatian because the breeders of the”English”type do not health test for inherent health problems(HD ED etc)They opt for the “modern”Germanic type from working lines, who are tested not only for health, but working ability, character & conformation to the breed standard. I know because a force boought a young German bred dog from me who became a highly successful serving Police dog
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quote>Posted by Anon 20th August, 2008 at 2:27 am
I am disgusted at what I witnessed during the show last night. I will NOT attend Crufts again nor will I buy a Kennel Club registered dog in the future as clearly they are NOT any different from any other unregistered or cross breed dog. Shame on the Kennel Club for misleading the public in this way and implying their dogs are healthier!! I hope the BBC comes to its senses and withdraws all publicity for the Kennel Club for the dogs sake!<
So you will be buying pedigree dogs from unregistered, unhealth tested parents, possibly closely related ????? I do not understand your logic
Not every breeder(in fact very very few)do close breedings such as brother/sister etc-this is far more common amoungst those who breed non registered dogs & have no knowledge of the breeding of their dogs. They may have two dogs & simply allow them to breed & breed & then their offspring do the same-the buyers will have no way of knowing. Anyone can make up a pedigree & register with a commerical company like Dog Lovers Registration Club who will register any dogs. You can even register dogs with them that do not exist, they do not have breed databases to check.
I will give you an example of the tess I have had done on my dogs-DNA tests for CEA(CH)-Collie Eye Anomaly( Choroidal Hypoplasia)an eye condition that can mean the dog is blind, TNS-Trapped Neurophil Syndrome-dogs die if they have this, NCL-Neuronal Ceriod Lipofuscinosis-dogs that have this die, MDR 1-MultiDrug Reaction-if dogs that have this are given certain drugs they can have bad reactons & die. Clinical tests for Hip Dysplasia & Progressive Retinal Atrophy. these are fast becoming standard tests being done on one of my breeds-not a fancy show breed, but a British working breed, Border Collies. KC registered dogs are far more likely to have had all the health tests done than even the working sheepdogs from the ISDS(the registry for shepherd/farmer bred dogs)
So if you were to buy an unregistered Border Collie-odds are that the breeder willnot even have heard of any of these conditions let alone tested for them
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Quote: ‘very much hope that if Crufts is shown again on the BBC, it will be as a very different kind of show. Sack Ben Fogle and hire some good investigative journalists, a geneticist and a vet (without vested interests).’
Dont forget Peter Purves as well as the ‘Geordie and the American’ double act too when it comes to the sackings!
lol
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Dyane Jones said “How many mongrels are health screeed ? & please don’t roll out that they don’t have health problems because they have exactly the same basic genetic make up asa pedigree dog.”
No they don’t. Mongrels have open gene pools (genetic diversity), pedigree dogs have closed gene pools (restricted and reduced genetic diversity). The reason pedigrees suffer from a high incidence of hereditary disease is due to the increased chance of two of the very same disease carrying genes meeting up in a closed gene pool compared to a mongrel’s open and varied gene pool. The problem is then increased again by breeders reducing genetic diversity further, in gene pools which are already closed, by line breeding to fix traits. With open and varied gene pools (mongrels) there is arguably little need to health test. In closed gene pools health testing is required if you are to avoid the likelihood of two of the same disease carrying genes meeting up. Unfortunately though pedigree dogs have become so inbred there are more hereditary diseases than there are specific health tests available. Continuing to reduce gene pools to win shows is the reason pedigree dogs are in the state they’re in. To try to pass blame onto back yard breeders, who although are not health testing are likely to randomly mate and therefore less likely to reduce, although not impossible, gene pools further, only serves to cover up the real problem by passing the blame, a problem the very top KC breeders are themselves causing. Until the breeders who are supposed to care accept this and follow the advice of population geneticists, pedigrees will continue to suffer, no doubt to the point where they’re gene pools will become so reduced they cease to exist, while in the mean time a large portion of pedigree dogs are suffering.
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Alot has been said on this site about the faults in pedigree dogs since the BBC program brought the problems to the forground. However no-one can say how irradicate these breed faults in the breeds mentioned.Breeding dogs has become big business with the cost of the dogs and the Insurance that you are persuaded to have for them, which really isn’t worth the paper it is written on. It comes down to the fact that if you have a problem with any animal be it pedigree or not you still have to foot the bill for that animal and wait until your insurer decides whether or not they will pay up your incurred vets bill. When the animal gets into old age the premium get larger and the pay out becomes less. I have had German Shepherds for 20 years and have had problems with all of them. The first had hip displasia and then dislocated her neck at the age of 8 years old and had to be eusthanised The second suffered from arthritis from the age of 7 years although her hip score was good. She also suffered from degenerative mylopathy and furunculosis from the same age.She lasted until she was 10years old when one morning she got up went outside and her back end collapsed so there was nothing the vet could do to save her.The Vet said that these problems were all too common in German Shepherds. The breeder of her said that if you got a German Shepherd over the age of 8 yers you had done well!!!!!!!!!! My 3rd Gds is now 2years and 3 months old and when I had her hip scored at 18months old her score was horrendous and she was already showing signs of athritis around her hip joints.I also have a 7month old pup who is showing signs of becoming cow hocked so I will be interested to see what her hip score shows up when she becomes one year old.I have followed the guide lines with all of them by not overwalking them until their bones are fully formed. My Vet says that german shepherds are born with loose hips and that they don’t firm up until they are one year old.From the puppy stage they are extremely active dogs so it is difficult to stop them running around and jumping up, it is in their nature to do this. My Vet tells me that it is not my fault that these problems have occurred it is a breed fault.The first Gds I had came from what I suppose you would term as a puppy farmer The second and fourth from the same breeder who was also a show judge The 2year old from a breeder who I really feel cares about his dogs and is always on hand if I need help or advice. Unless you can find a German shepherd who has been bred from 2 dogs with a nil hip score you stand to have an animal with with problems in later life as the hereditary problem will carry forward into any pups produced in future generations. I therefore cannot see that these faults can be irradicated now. I also have a Jack Russell cross and he is the healtiest and fittest of all of them which I feel says it all.
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I have said this for years! Those people that support the KC need their heads examined. Whether that being by supporting Crufts or indeed buying a KC reg dog. Apart from Breeders, I don't understand why ANYONE would need a peice of paper to prove the pedigree (or worth) of a dog! Lets face it, unless you intend to breed your dog, your registration is worthless. All i am interested in when buying a puppy, is seeing and interacting with its parents. I have had GSD dogs all my life and i don't need a KC registration to tell me who they are or what they are.
I have watched crufts once, and it made me sick to my stomach. Unnatural dogs with fur shaved from their legs and body. GSD's that need a certain posture and 'sloping' spine! Without doubt inbred!
I hope that Crufts never returns to the Beeb, or any other channel for that matter.
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As an exhibitor at Crufts I am disadvantaged by the BBC’s position.
As a dog lover I am proud to contribute to an organisation that has the guts to stand up to the practices sanctioned by the KC.
Anyone who thinks that the GSD looks normal is at best myopic.
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Nothing to learn from Sweden. ,
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